Mitnick Banned From Security Group

Mitnick Banned From Security Group
Kevin Poulsen, SecurityFocus 2003-02-13

By all accounts ex-hacker Kevin Mitnick created only a modest stir when he sauntered into the December meeting of the Los Angeles chapter of the Information Systems Security Association (ISSA). He sat quietly, paid attention, and at the conclusion of the meeting joined with some of the other 60-odd attendees swapping business cards, chatting with fellow computer security workers and discussing his plans for his new consulting business, Defensive Thinking. "He wasn't flashy at all," recalls one chapter member, who didn't recognize Mitnick until the conclusion of the meeting. "He introduced himself as 'Kevin.'"

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous (3 replies)

Typical case of Puritans who advocate a strict criminal justice system, agonise over their hypocrisy with the view of portraying respectability, but never believe in the rehabilitation and re-admittance of people who have served their terms.

He who has never offended cast the first stone, just beca...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous (3 replies)

Would you let a convicted child molester be a playground supervisor or babysit your children just based on the fact he says he is reformed and paid his debt. Not that I am calling Kevin a child molester, but I think the same issue applies. He needs to look at his past and accept the consequences tha...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous

"Would you let a convicted child molester be a playground supervisor..."

Congratulations, I don't think you could have stated your objections in more hysterical terms. Personally, I don't think Mitnick should be allowed to join because I have a tape of Bin Laden urging support for him! :)...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-15
TrueLyFE

This is a security group, not a playground. He didn't hurt anyone, and has PROVEN on many an occasion that he DOES want to help.

From a security standpoint, dont you think his past experiences would be more of a help than hindrance in such a group?...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-20
Anonymous

The difference here is that the principle is different. This group is geared on Security to help. The basis of a child molester is to hurt and take advantage of with full understanding that you are wrong in the first place. Making the decision to let Mitnick in should not be one made in one day. ...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-18
Anonymous (1 replies)

I have never illegally broken into another computer system, but I think that the ISSA is wrong for not giving someone a chance that has already paid his debt. And from a professional viewpoint I am convinced that taking this stand makes the ISSA irrelavent and not capable of contributing to the anti...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-19
Anonymous

Bingo.

What is one of the greatest resources in anti-hacking and security? Learning the tricks and techniques that have been proven to work. He is a valuable resource for teaching people about how the quote unquote hacker mind works. The exploits he used in the past may not be relevant any more, bu...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-18
Anonymous

I am not calling him a hero or anything, and after such a long period of time with no computer, it is not like he is really "consultant" ready. (Unless he has been reading massive books, and lots of them to help make up for no real hacking) but this action by the ISSA shows that they are made up of ...

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Zone-H position about ISSA rejectin Mitnick's membership application 2003-02-13
Anonymous (1 replies)

My father tought me an important lesson: "those who care only about questions of principles are going to loose in their life".

Admitting Mitnick (despite his past) to ISSA might have been a smart move, as he would probalby contribute to the association more that most of the people who are currently...

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Zone-H position about ISSA rejectin Mitnick's membership application 2003-02-13
Anonymous (2 replies)

You sound like a hacker, so it puts you in Kevin's league. Zone-H, what a stupid handle.

First of all, it is our principals that seperate us from the animals. Murderers, rapist, low-lifes of all kinds feel that their principals are just fine. Look at the devistation that was caused by Enron and ...

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Zone-H position about ISSA rejectin Mitnick's membership application 2003-02-13
SyS64738 www.zone-h.org admin

Zone-H stays for www.zone-h.org. No, I am not an hacker, I am not a Mitnick's personal fan but I like to use my brain.

Probably I can spend my one cent contributing to this discussion in a decent way.

You have to respect it.

...

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mark him bad forever! 2003-02-16
wicked

"anonymous" handle sounds more respectable, isn't it?

what can mitnick do now? no more security projects? no more possibilities to help whitehats? do you know that (in the name of moral principles) you are forcing him to move back on black side of chessboard? do we allow him any other choice?

...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous

By your comments you don't know anything about the Puritans. Don't libel out of ignorance....

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous (3 replies)

I applaud the ISSA.

Mr. Mitnick may have paid his time, but that doesn't change his character. Paying time != reforming.

If we, as an industry, want to be taken seriously, we need to be more critical of those who want to be admitted into our professional circles. He broke the law. We should...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-15
Anonymous

First of all, unless you know Kevin you are in no position to judge his character. Otherwise all you would know is what you've heard or read, and if you do look at the facts, you'd know there wasn't any malicious intent. If curiosity, and lack of judgement(combined with youth)were felonies, how many...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-20
Anonymous

You sound very much like those people who think sys administration can be quantified into neat little packages, then taught at MCSA and A+ courses. That's about 25% of what you actually need to know, ignoring the rest doesn't take into account creativity or non-linear thinking, which Mitnick probab...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-22
Anonymous

I agree that paying time does not equal reforming. However, Kevin has done more than that. He has 'repented' in the classical sense of the word. He has cleaned up his act, asked forgiveness for his acknowledged past mistakes, and has been living the straight-and-narrow since then.

Please forgive ...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous

I say screw 'em, Mitnick doesn't need their approval to show what a valuable asset he can be to the computer security field. In fact, their very narrow-mindedness regarding his admission is a perfect example of everything that is wrong with the field today....

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous (1 replies)

ouch,

well i feel that if someone did their time they deserve another chance....

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-13
Anonymous

It is more than apparent that he has an incredible grasp on the computer security world, I would think that he would be an asset to their organization. Their banning was the equivalent of trying to design a gun while refusing to shoot one....

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No girls allowed. 2003-02-13
<- (1 replies)

By excluding Mitnick, the ISSA is cementing its reputation as an ivory tower entity with too much theory and too little practice to have relevant input on real-world issues.

By begging them to let him in, Mitnick is doing himself a disservice. He should have walked away. I won't say he's humil...

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No girls allowed. 2003-02-17
Anonymous

Well, Kevin is trying to start a business, and it would probably do his business well if he was a member of a professional organization. I am sure he isn't joining just for his own pleasure, it is most likely a business move.

They certainly have the right to refuse to admit him, and it seems as ...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Anonymous (1 replies)

Mitnick Banned from Security Group... So what!!

Kevin needs peace!

far away from this spotlights...

Next issue is: Mitnick flunked CISSP ?!?

...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Anonymous (2 replies)

I doubt that he would fail the CISSP, but it is a moot point anyway. They will never allow him to test, because he has a felony conviction.

If the ISSA had rules like the CISSP in place before Mitnick applied, there would be no issue here. The problem lies in the fact that there was no rule in ...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Maestro

I think some people are trying to see Mitnicks behaivour in to much of a Black and White context. Yes, he broke the law but is a man who steals bread for his family then a bad man? I'm not saying Mitnicks motivation was as well intentioned as in in the afore mentioned, but I will say that to my know...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
keydet89 (at) yahoo (dot) com [email concealed] (1 replies)

For all your talk about the organization, you failed to grasp the central issue. It isn't that Mr. Mitnick is a "former" hacker...the issue is that he's a _convicted_ hacker....

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-18
Anonymous

Soooo, being a hacker is Ok, just don't get convicted?...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
blastfurnas

"Would you let a convicted child molester be a playground supervisor..."

its not the same thing, theyre different crimes. they come from different minds, one is to break into a system without permission, the other is to molest an innocent child. how is that the same? you have to have something wr...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Anonymous

It would be strange to believe that an organisation which has been situated for 20 years or so, has not one member who broken some form computer law. Surely any one in the field of computer security, who is that intense upon it, has stumbled over the legal / illegal line at some stage in their life....

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Anonymous (2 replies)

This absolutely sucks, but Kevin should be doing a lecture circuit, not attending meetings where people come clean with their vulnerabilities. How do we know he isn't simply applying social engineering for his next conquest? Though he isn't malicious, he is dangerous.

I liken him to a big friend...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-14
Anonymous

"Given the technical nature of the issues brought up at those types of meetings, and Kevins obvious skills with social engineering, and his past, it is easy to imagine him finding it easier than ever, and a little too tempting to play."

so a person who is an acholic should not go in to a market ...

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Did nobody here read Mitnick's book ? 2003-02-16
Anonymous

Dear fellow,

are you a bit tired theses times ?

"How do we know he isn't simply applying social engineering for his next conquest?"

"enough for me to not want to tell him what types of servers I am running"

If he wanted to use social engineering on you, he surely wouldn't tell you how to p...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-15
Anonymous

How can anyone take this guy seriously since his own "Defensive Thinking" web site was hacked not once but twice with the same IIS issue for which patches have been available? This guy knows he's going to be a target and yet he cannot protect himself.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/02/11/h...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-16
Anonymous

A snake will always be a snake even if you change it's skin....

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Mitnick: Show us, don't tell us! 2003-02-16
Anonymous

Why does Kevin Mitnick believe that everyone should bow down to him? "Mitnick was convicted or plead guilty five times since the 1980s to crimes resulting from his hacking habits and social engineering forays."..Alex Salkever, Businessweek.com.

Mitnick's entire life has been a social engineering...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-17
Anonymous

Have any of you ever even been to an ISSA meeting? All this talk about "discussing serious vulnerabilities within member companies..." What meetings do you go to?

In my experience, the ISSA meetings I've been to were far more social in nature than technical. On top of that, much of the tech...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-18
chr00t (at) yahoo (dot) com [email concealed]

ISSA has it's own rules, Mr. Mitnick has nothing to do with it. That's a question of reputation ISSA not going to risk.

As says it's Code of Ethics, it's participants should "Refrain from any activities which might constitute a conflict of interest or otherwise damage the reputation of employers,...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-19
Anonymous

So typical of 'Security Proffesionals' a bunch of politics that wont allow for people trying to help them better themselves. They are so afraid of themselves that they cant see past their noses. Just like a local college who tried to ban a student because an instructor heard words like 'spoofing' ...

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Just a publicity stunt by ISSA.. 2003-02-19
Snowdog

IMHO, it appears that this is just a publicity stunt by ISSA to grab some "Mitnick" headlines. It was clear that he was quietly trying to join the organization. Undoubtedly to help his consulting business along. However, when the LA Chapter of the ISSA noticed it could grab bigger headlines by refu...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-19
Anonymous (1 replies)

What's the purpose of prison or jail for rehabilitation? Why must something follow you around for the rest of your life even if you done something in your early teens? It's a non profit organization. The only way to get good security is to hire hackers. They guy is a legend he doesn't make any more ...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-22
Anonymous

So you think someone like BRINKS (armoured cars) would be justified in hiring ex-bank robbers to drive their trucks? Hey, they did their time in jail, right? You trust them with YOUR money don't you?

The question is one of ethics. There was a point (early in his career) when Kevin KNEW that wh...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-20
Anonymous

They just don't want anyone who knows more about security then any of them. I've been to those meetings, and the majority of folks there are clueless. They just don't think outside of the box. Mitnick has paid his debt to society and has reformed. Why continue to punish him?

Remember part of thi...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-21
Anonymous

I have been a member of ISSA for over 7 years and a local board member as well. Kevin Mitnick has no business being a ISSA member. He has shown consistent criminal behavior in the area of computer security. The criminal acts that he did were not as a teenager but as an adult. He also fled law en...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-21
Anonymous

Mitnick certainly is able to generate a great deal of interest and discussion.

My two cents worth: it is a sad but true fact that decisions you make early on often have consequences that affect you for the rest of your life.

I don't think this has anything to do with publicity for the ISSA; I...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-21
Anonymous

Although Kevin has skill albeit somewhat antiquated I would think at this point, it seems to me that one of the things he forfieted was his opportunity to join organizations such as ISSA, CISSP, and the like where ethics are foundational lynchpins. I would also like to pint out that while what he d...

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Mitnick Banned From Security Group 2003-02-21
Hamster1:)

For or against Mitnick ?. I think the real issue is not so much Mitnick himself, but how we perceive Mitnick and ourselves. If we feel "better than" him we tend to take on a self-righteous mind set. If we identify with him we might put him on a pedestal. Only time will tell Mitnick's real motives, a...

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I may not renew my ISSA memberfship 2003-02-22
Anonymous

I am a CISSP working in the security department for a major F100 corporation. I am appalled at this sophomoric behavior by the ISSA and at this time I am not planning to renew my membership at any level.

Information security isn't a club, it's a profession. If G. Gordon Liddy can work as a securi...

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